In part two, April and Glen gain ideas from Janet Harris, Executive Director & CEO of the Rockefeller Institute on Petit Jean Mountain, for helping various groups of Arkansans facing difficult differences to join together in finding common ground for problem-solving. Other topics covered include the importance of relationships in improving working relationships during this process, which prompted this quote from Janet: "the beauty of humanity is in that wrestling...". We review some of the initial efforts now underway with the institute and other groups (including our Braver Angels alliance) in helping promote civic engagement, which some data suggests is a particular problem in Arkansas. Other topics include addressing misinformation in our current media environment, Governor Rockefeller's initial motivation for running for office as a Republican (it's not what you might think), and a general description of how groups coming to the mountain for this process come to "wrestle with complexity" and how out of that process, she finds hope. Finally, Janet shares a remarkable story that started with her witnessing an aerial combat between two bald eagles while driving to work on top of Petit Jean mountain. The story serves as a fitting metaphor for the work of the Rockefeller Institute.

In this first part of our conversation with Janet Harris, Executive Director & CEO of the Rockefeller Institute on Petit Jean Mountain, Glen and April learn about the Rockefeller Institute, which is guided by former Governor Winthrop Rockefeller's belief that “...valuing diversity of opinion, practicing collaborative problem solving, and engaging in respectful dialogue combine to create transformational change.” As we explore the Institute's mission and Janet's role, she shares stories from her early life, including how playing high school and college basketball taught her many lessons in leadership. The many retreats held at the institute seek to help various groups of Arkansans who encounter "wicked problems" which have no clear way of solving them without compromise by the various stakeholders. Ground rules that help facilitate that outcome are presented, and she describes some specific groups and issues in Arkansas where positive outcomes have been achieved through this process. Janet encourages people of all sorts around the state to consider using the institute's facilities and staff when there is a need to solve a "wicked problem" with significant impediments to finding common ground and acceptable compromises. The natural setting on top of Petit Jean Mountain, the beautiful and comfortable facilities, and having meals and down time together help to move participants toward a better working relationship.

In this second part of our conversation with Breanne Davis, Republican Arkansas state senator from Russellville & sponsor of the LEARNS act in 2023, Breanne goes into some detail about the LEARNS law and how she views some resistance as due to misinformation about what it does. Acknowledging some genuine differences of view on this law, she describes how she feels it has important contributions to education in Arkansas. Other laws she sponsored and that were passed are reviewed, including helping ensure non-discriminatory access to healthcare for persons with Down syndrome. Asked to explain the extent to which she views 2nd amendment gun rights as having legitimate areas for regulation, she talks about some areas that are currently not well enforced, and she talks about proposed regulations such as Red Flag laws that she finds troubling. She concludes by talking about the importance of connection with other people in working on political issues, as well as need for reducing social media's negative, distorting influences. Civic engagement to her is served if we have "more community heroes and fewer keyboard warriors."

Breanne Davis, Republican Arkansas state senator from Russellville & sponsor of LEARNS act in 2023, sits down to talk with Glen & April in this first part of our conversation. Breanne's background growing up with a family that was active in their community and a longstanding interest in working with others motivated her to get involved, eventually running for and being elected as state Senator. She is a co-chair of the "Arkansas Futures Caucus," a bipartisan group of younger legislators who work together to get things done. Despite the history of partisan differences and tensions, she suggests that many in the legislature work together and get things done, but this seldom is covered adequately in the media. Breanne believes it is important to "fight less" both within and across parties, and this helps motivate her involvement in this caucus. She describes how caucus members work together, though there is disagreement in several areas, and how important she finds it to engage with others in person, rather than via social media. One distressing and puzzling part of her experience is what she calls "100 Percenters," those persons in her party who complain or respond with hostile language if she says or votes in any manner that doesn't fit entirely with their view of how things should be. This "perfectionism" often comes from people in her own party and who know her personally. While she believes strongly in compromise to get things done, she outlines some areas where her core beliefs do not lend her to compromising.

In this second part of our interview with Dr. Blake Perkins, ASU-Beebe professor of history, we further explore his insights into the culture and politics of rural Arkansans in the Ozark region, who he terms "Ozarkers." In this episode, he provides additional detail into the reality, as opposed to stereotypes, of Ozarkers' frequently described distrust of outsiders. He includes lessons from history and his studies that suggest ways to reduce misunderstandings of people such as rural Arkansans, and he outlines some of the understandable and rational basis for some of their views. He also offers one model of how to use debate exercises in the classroom about historical events as a means of helping students to better appreciate diversity of views and ideologies, while promoting critical thinking about an issue. Current suspicion in some quarters about the value of higher education is also discussed. Dr. Perkins concludes with a humorous story of how another professor's energetic engagement with his class ended up revealing more of the professor than he likely wanted.

Dr. Blake Perkins, History professor at ASU-Beebe, talks with Glen and April about his research on the history of "Ozarkers" or rural folk in the Arkansas mountains over the last couple of centuries. He specifically addresses aspects of how these Arkansans have tended to view "outsiders," whether those from state or federal government, from more urban areas, or persons with money and influence. Given the importance of such divisions in understanding polarization in our current society, we felt it helpful to hear his insights, which not only are academic in nature, but also arise in part from his early life being born and raised in rural Arkansas. Blake talks in some detail about both the realities of this culture as well as some myths or stereotypes that don't always correspond to reality. He cites examples of "outsiders" who thrived in the Ozark culture, for example. We also delve into current controversies regarding potential changes in the status of the Buffalo River's national park designation, as well as the recent LEARNS law and its changes that pose some concerns to rural Ozarkers.

In this second part of our talk with former judge and social justice activist Wendell Griffen, we hear his defense of the importance for civility in discourse and the willingness to engage with those on the other side. He points to how the games we played - and their rules that we followed as children - continues to be a critical model for us to follow as adults. He sees the need for similar attention to laws and civil behavior in our political discourse. Wendell also tells us about his experiences during a recent public forum on the Middle East conflict and how he and the other panelists, with strongly differing views, were able to follow guidelines and thus have a respectful and productive exchange of perspectives on this highly divisive topic. He offers reason for hope for our future in young people, who he sees as wanting civil discourse and as being willing to get involved in their community. Finally, he offers his thoughts on how each of us can make a difference in our community.

Here's a guest you should make a point to listen to: Wendell Griffen, a veteran, attorney, retired judge, CEO of his own organization, author, public speaker, and the pastor at the New Millennium Church in Little Rock. In part 1 of this interview, April and Glen sit down with Wendell, well known in Arkansas as a passionate advocate for various social justice issue. Here he explains how his views originate from influences by his parents growing up, as well Jesus, Martin Luther King, Jr, and others. He especially resonates with the call to "love the least of these." Wendell embraces a version of Christianity that he contrasts with what he terms "empirical Christianity," a version that troubles him and is covered in his upcoming book "The Hateful Faithful." Yet he urges being open to talking to others as critical for growth ("iron sharpens iron"). The struggle he sees is chaos vs community, where fear feeds chaos. He sides with the forming and strengthening of community. In a powerful metaphor, he relates a personal story that helped motivate him to be more active in his community. The inspiration came to him in learning to swim as an adult and led him to realize that we need the courage to "get off the side of the pool" and into the deep water in order to "learn how to swim."