April and Glen are joined by Annabelle Clinton Imber Tuck, a trailblazer in Arkansas law and the first woman ever elected to the Arkansas Supreme Court. In this first part of our conversation with Annabelle, we hear about her early life, starting in Arkansas, and including living in South America and later in Washington, DC, then winding up back in her beloved home state of Arkansas. She describes her early life influences, her interests in the legal profession, and the intense sense of justice and fairness that has influenced her work through the years. She also explains her political leanings, which some may find surprising. She highlights her longstanding desire for everyone in court to be heard and for justice to be done, with emphasis on the value of due process.

This episode of On The Other Hand is a “best of” recording of an interview in July 2024, when Glen and April spoke with Asa Hutchinson, an attorney and the previous 2-term Republican governor of Arkansas. Asa’s long history of public service includes serving as a US Congressman, one of the House managers for Bill Clinton’s impeachment trial in the Senate, head of the Drug Enforcement Administration, and chair of the National Governors Association. Asa had just recently concluded an unsuccessful campaign for the Republican presidential nominee for the 2024 election at the time of this interview. In the interview, Asa described his then current activities, what he viewed as highlights of his career, and the approach he took as governor. He explained how he handled the COVID pandemic during his term as governor, which included consulting with a variety of experts and weighing various views to help him find a way to manage Arkansas's approach to COVID that adhered to his conservative philosophy. While he outlined his strong conservative credentials, Asa also expressed concerns about several developments nationally. In particular, we heard his criticisms of how he saw the Republican party as having moved away from traditional conservative values, and his conviction that civility and compromise remain critical for the success of our government.

In part 2 of our conversation with community activist Kwami Abdul-Bey, we hear about both his formal and atypical means of education that have led him to who he is today. He also outlines problems during his early times at the Air Force Academy due to his Muslim religion and related negative reactions occurring at a time when war with Iraq was breaking out. Some of his challenges during his early years included time being homeless. Subsequent choices about education were made with an eye to learning how best to help his community and to pass that information along to his fellow citizens. Emphasizing the importance of participation in democracy, Kwami asserts that “the fewer citizens that are involved in the process, the better off the people in power are.” He also reminds us that it is our responsibility to prepare our world to be in better shape for our children, relating it to the native American “7 generations rule”. Throughout the interview, Kwami focuses on the importance of all citizens getting involved and participating in democracy.

April and guest co-host John have a conversation with community activist Kwami Abdul-Bey, who has been a friend of Braver Angels in Arkansas for some time, co-founded or led local organizations, and serves as the Elections Coordinator & Organizer for the Arkansas Public Policy Panel. In this first part of our interview with Kwami, we explore his current involvement with several organizations locally. He provides his perspective on direct democracy and his concerns about recent laws that he believes raise barriers to Arkansas’s citizen initiatives process. A key response to him includes the importance of developing greater civic education. Kwami shares his worries about current challenges with democracy, which he sees as not now working as he was taught, something that especially troubles him as he seeks to answer questions his kids are raising about what is going on now, based on what they hear. Among his attempts to enhance community response to those challenges, he has helped create the Washitaw Foothills Youth Media Arts & Literacy Collective. Other aspects of our discussion include his views of dealing with both the “grass tops” and the “grass roots” in his community advocacy. Kwami also talks about his recent experience of running for public office as a Democrat, despite his history of being an independent. Despite much negative reaction to his association with the Democratic party, he tells us a story of one voter who sought him out and apologized to him recently for having been disrespectful to him because he ran as Democrat, after the winner the man voted for proved to not be who he thought. Kwami urges citizen involvement, stating “let’s stop being spectators, because democracy is not a spectator sport.”

In the second part of our conversation with Dr. Sherry Simon and Rev. Britt Skarda, we continue exploring what motivates their sustained civic participation and how people of faith can model engagement rooted in love and respect. Both guests describe the weekly gatherings in protest outside Congressman French Hill’s office as a diverse and committed community of citizens, consisting of veterans, teachers, parents, and neighbors, who come together out of concern for the country’s democratic health and future generations.

The discussion broadens to consider the challenges of political leadership, the tensions between principle and compromise, and the importance of maintaining dialogue even when disagreements run deep. Sherry and Britt emphasize the need for courage, empathy, and moral clarity in public life, noting that “we don’t have enough models for loving kindness” and exhorting listeners that “democracy is teetering on the edge… get out there… do something!”

We continue to seek Congressman Hill’s perspective for a future episode to enrich this conversation and deepen understanding across differing views.

In the 3rd and final part of our conversation with Jim Lagrone of Family Council's Church Ambassador Network, April and Glen explore with Jim issues of political polarization and civil discourse. Jim stressed the importance of character in political leadership, noting that leaders mirror the values of their culture. He shared his admiration for forgiveness shown amidst tragedy. Jim also provided practical advice for navigating political polarization within congregations, advising pastors to emphasize spiritual guidance, love, and respectful communication. The discussion touched upon concerns about the divisiveness of issues like abortion and the role of the 24-hour news cycle. Jim also affirmed the importance of caring for the environment, a value he admits some Christians have not always appreciated. Given the knowledge we now have of its importance, he suggests environmental concerns should be embraced. Jim also promoted the idea of political unity through initiatives like Braver Angels, discussing the challenges of engaging conservative churches, and he shared his mixed personal feelings about figures like Donald Trump, while advising against criticizing or endorsing politicians when advocating for unity.

In part 2 of our conversation with Jim Lagrone, he tells of a Baptist pastor who moved his family into a troubled neighborhood to turn it around, showing the positive ways faith-based efforts can have impacts beyond what occurs on Sundays in church. He also described pilot programs in Arkansas and other states where churches successfully collaborated to address social needs like crime and homelessness. Jim emphasized the importance of faith leaders collaborating with government officials on shared community goals, despite potential policy disagreements. He also said he advises pastors against endorsing political candidates, despite recent IRS statements that now allow those actions in churches. Jim then argues that misconceptions of "Christian nationalism" serve primarily as a political "attack line" used to target churches. He urged Christians to focus on building genuine relationships with others and approaching them with the love and understanding of Jesus rather than resorting to judgment of others or focusing on legislating morality.