Joe Hudson is an executive coach for tech CEOs like Sam Altman, and is a cofounder of the Art of Accomplishment. In this in-person interview, we sat down to talk about what I like to think of as the first principles of inner work. We explore Joe's beliefs about joy, including nuances around creating safety, his philosophy on teaching without dependency, and how relational work acts as “rocket fuel” for personal transformation. Most importantly, we discuss how the hell he has almost zero tension in his belly.

Time-stamps

00:04 Why does my wife trust Joe more after seeing how little tension he has in his belly?
00:06 How 7 years of breathwork rewired his capacity for authenticity + emotional expression
00:25 The reason self-trust + trust in life are actually the same skill
00:28 Why enjoyment is the most efficient way to work
00:38 How true safety (ironically) requires acknowledging that we're never truly safe
00:43 Why Joe rarely buys into people's stories
00:49 The common trap that stagnates the personal growth of so many teachers (and how to avoid it)
00:55 The hilarious story behind Joe's secret nickname 'Burt McCracken'
01:03 One definition of narcissism is the inability to feel emotions
01:05 The reason that relational work accelerates personal transformation (compared to solo efforts)

Learn More About Joe Hudson + AoA

👨‍🏫 Get discounted access to their courses here
🎧 Listen to the fantastic AoA Podcast (my top 10 episodes)
🎬 Watch Joe's Youtube Videos @artofaccomplishment

Explore More from Jonny

👋 Follow on Twitter/X @jonnym1ller
🫁 Learn more about Nervous System Mastery
🎴 Order our deck of Calm Cards (these make great gifts)
📱 Check out Stateshift — our brand new iOS + Android app
📝 Take the Nervous System Quotient (NSQ) Self-Assessment (totally free)

🫁 Episode Sponsor — Nervous System Mastery

This is my flagship 5-week bootcamp designed to equip you with evidence-backed protocols to cultivate calm and emotional regulation. Our 8th cohort will run in Fall 2025 ~ and applications are currently open. My sense is that if this conversation resonates with you, then you'd likely be a great fit for our upcoming cohort. This curriculum represents my attempt to distill everything I've learned in recent years about creating the conditions for our nervous system's flourishing. It's run in an intensive cohort-based way since this is, in my experience, the most efficient way to embody and practice the protocols.

Previous students have shared how partaking improved their sleep and quality of relationships and tapped into deeper states of joy, clarity, and confidence in their lives. We've had over 1000 students have completed this training, and many have said that it has been the most impactful thing they've ever done for their personal growth — so if you're intrigued at all, you can find more details and apply to join this year's cohort over at nsmastery.com

Further Ways to Support the Podcast:

🎙️ I use Riverside to record all of my podcast conversations (it's so much better than zoom for podcasting!)
🎧 I also use Transistor to host this podcast, it's fricking awesome, and I would highly recommend.
😎 RaOptics make the world's best Blue Blockers – I wear these anytime I'm out of the house after dark, and it makes a huge difference!
🤖 I use AI wizardry from Castmagic to help with each episode's show-notes + timestamps
📝 Test out my favourite journaling app using journal prompts that have made a huge impact in my life.

Franzi is someone whose work sits at the powerful intersection of nervous system health, emotional resilience, and embodied leadership.

What I admire most about her is the way she weaves personal integrity, deep inquiry, and relational intelligence into every facet of her life — from parenting her three sons to working with founders navigating burnout and stuck emotions. We explore what it truly means to lead from a place of wholeness — and why she believes leadership should be a force for healing, not just productivity. Franzi shares how curiosity became her greatest ally through grief and trauma, and how movement became a portal into somatic healing.

We also discuss the difference between performative boundaries and boundaries that foster deeper connection, how interoception builds relational capacity, and why numbness is often the most potent entry point into this work.

Other topics we touch on include:

🌿 The cost of chronic performance zones & reclaiming peripheral vision
🧠 How somatics and neuroscience go hand-in-hand — and why embodiment is often mislabeled as “woo”
🧒 Her radical, nervous-system-based approach to parenting and education
💡 The power of practicing self-inquiry through the simple questions: Who am I? Why am I here? Where am I going?
🫀 And what it means to live a life rooted in belonging, dignity, and safety

This one is rich, spacious, and full of grounded wisdom — I hope you enjoy it as much as I did.

Connect with Franzi

🖥️ Learn about Franzi's Work
📝 Read Franzi's Writing

Connect + Explore More from Jonny

🐦 Follow on Twitter/X @jonnym1ller
🫁 Learn more about Nervous System Mastery
🪷 Order our deck of Calm Cards (these make great gifts)
📱 Check out Stateshift — our brand new iOS + Android app
📝 Take the Nervous System Quotient (NSQ) Self-Assessment (totally free)

🫁 Episode Sponsor — Nervous System Mastery

This is my flagship 5-week bootcamp designed to equip you with evidence-backed protocols to cultivate calm and emotional regulation. Our 8th cohort will run in Fall 2025 ~ and applications are currently open. My sense is that if this conversation resonates with you, then you'd likely be a great fit for our upcoming cohort. This curriculum represents my attempt to distill everything I've learned in recent years about creating the conditions for our nervous system's flourishing. It's run in an intensive cohort-based way since this is, in my experience, the most efficient way to embody and practice the protocols.

Previous students have shared how partaking improved their sleep and quality of relationships and tapped into deeper states of joy, clarity, and confidence in their lives. We've had over 1000 students have completed this training, and many have said that it has been the most impactful thing they've ever done for their personal growth — so if you're intrigued at all, you can find more details and apply to join this year's cohort over at nsmastery.com

Further Ways to Support the Podcast:

🎙️ I use Riverside to record all of my podcast conversations (it's so much better than zoom for podcasting!)
🎧 I also use Transistor to host this podcast, it's fricking awesome, and I would highly recommend.
😎 RaOptics make the world's best Blue Blockers – I wear these anytime I'm out of the house after dark, and it makes a huge difference!
🤖 I use AI wizardry from Castmagic to help with each episode's show-notes + timestamps
📝 Test out my favourite journaling app using journal prompts that have made a huge impact in my life.

In this episode, I’m speaking with a friend, author, entrepreneur & prolific writer Nat Eliason.

The timing of this conversation was interesting as we recorded it shortly before the US elections, after which the crypto markets shot back into the mainstream. You’ll hear about the intense emotional rollercoaster he went through, losing millions of dollars in a very short period of time — how it felt to write about this — what he’s learned about cultivating creative endurance with his writing, as well as his perspective on relaxation versus numbing and how our relationship with work pushes us towards coping mechanisms rather than genuine rest.

Official Links

👋 Follow Nat on Twitter/X @nateliason
📚 Read Crypto Confidential
🖥️ Nat's homepage

Connect + Explore More from Jonny

🐦 Follow on Twitter/X @jonnym1ller
🫁 Learn more about Nervous System Mastery
🪷 Order our deck of Calm Cards (these make great gifts)
📱 Check out Stateshift — our brand new iOS + Android app
📝 Take the Nervous System Quotient (NSQ) Self-Assessment (totally free)

🫁 Episode Sponsor — Nervous System Mastery

This is my flagship 5-week bootcamp designed to equip you with evidence-backed protocols to cultivate calm and emotional regulation. Our 8th cohort will run in Fall 2025 ~ and applications are currently open. My sense is that if this conversation resonates with you, then you'd likely be a great fit for our upcoming cohort. This curriculum represents my attempt to distill everything I've learned in recent years about creating the conditions for our nervous system's flourishing. It's run in an intensive cohort-based way since this is, in my experience, the most efficient way to embody and practice the protocols.

Previous students have shared how partaking improved their sleep and quality of relationships and tapped into deeper states of joy, clarity, and confidence in their lives. We've had over 1000 students have completed this training, and many have said that it has been the most impactful thing they've ever done for their personal growth — so if you're intrigued at all, you can find more details and apply to join this year's cohort over at nsmastery.com

Further Ways to Support the Podcast:

🎙️ I use Riverside to record all of my podcast conversations (it's so much better than zoom for podcasting!)
🎧 I also use Transistor to host this podcast, it's fricking awesome, and I would highly recommend.
😎 RaOptics make the world's best Blue Blockers – I wear these anytime I'm out of the house after dark, and it makes a huge difference!
🤖 I use AI wizardry from Castmagic to help with each episode's show-notes + timestamps
📝 Test out my favourite journaling app using journal prompts that have made a huge impact in my life.