How do you continue to show up in medicine after you've been hit with a $28 million malpractice lawsuit?

In this powerful and deeply vulnerable conversation, Dr. Amna Shabbir is joined by Dr. Gita Pensa, an emergency physician, Brown University faculty member, podcast host of Doctors and Litigation: The L Word, and fierce advocate for physician well-being. Dr. Pensa shares the raw truth of what it was like to face litigation, an ordeal that spanned over 12 years, and how that experience reshaped her understanding of perfectionism, shame, and identity in medicine.

Together, they unpack the silent emotional crisis physicians endure during malpractice litigation, how perfectionism can become a liability in high-pressure professions, and the critical need to build shame-resilient medical cultures.

Together, they explore:

✅Why perfectionism isn’t protecting you—it’s paralyzing you.
✅What happens when your entire identity as a "good doctor" collapses.
✅Why burnout and litigation are hitting perfectionists the hardest.
✅The unseen emotional and professional toll of malpractice lawsuits.
✅ What medicine can learn from shame research and why we need to talk about litigation out loud.
✅How Dr. Pensa is helping change the conversation through education, coaching, and advocacy.

👤 About the Guest:

Dr. Gita Pensa is an emergency room physician, educator, and advocate for physician well-being. After enduring a 12-year, $28 million malpractice lawsuit, she launched the podcast Doctors and Litigation: The L Word to support doctors facing litigation. Dr. Pensa has been featured in the award-winning documentary film, A World of Hurt: How Medical Malpractice Fails Everyone.

🔗Connect with Dr. Pensa:

💻 Website: https://www.doctorsandlitigation.com/
💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gita-pensa-m-d-693557189/
🎙️ Podcast: https://www.doctorsandlitigation.com/podcast

🎙About the Host:
Dr. Amna Shabbir is a Dual Board-certified Physician, Master Certified Coach, Professional Speaker, Employee Wellness Strategist, Mental Health Advocate, and Super Mom. She empowers high achievers to redefine success and create sustainable well-being via coaching, speaking, and virtual programs. Dr.Shabbir is the Founder of Amna Shabbir Wellness Coaching and the Early Career Physicians Institute®.

This episode is part of her special book-writing project on unmasking perfectionism.

🔗Connect with Dr. Shabbir:
📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dr.amnashabbir/
💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amna-shabbir-md/
🌍 Book Her to Speak: https://www.dramnashabbir.com/Speaking

❌ Disclaimer: This podcast is for educational purposes only and does not constitute medical or therapeutic advice. The views expressed are personal and do not reflect those of any employer or institution.

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“I have a license to practice medicine, but I don’t have a degree in martyrdom.”

In this honest and heartfelt conversation, Dr. Laura Vater, a gastrointestinal oncologist, TEDx speaker, and creator of the SMILE Scale, joins Dr. Amna Shabbir to unmask the hidden costs of perfectionism in medicine. Together, they navigate the often-unspoken emotional toll of striving, sacrificing, and surviving in a system that rewards overwork and overlooks humanity.
This episode challenges the idea that exhaustion is a badge of honor. Instead, it invites all clinicians and high performers to reconnect with their humanity, share their truth, and find freedom in rest.

Together, they explore:
✅ The unrelenting internal pressure to “do it all” as a physician, mother, and high achiever
✅ Dr. Vater’s raw and courageous story of burnout and suicidal ideation during residency
✅ How the culture of medicine reinforces perfectionism and emotional concealment
✅ The impact of sleep deprivation on empathy and the science behind compassion fatigue
✅ The SMILE Scale—a simple, research-backed self-check-in for daily wellness
✅ Creating space for imperfection and redefining success as a human being, not a machine

👤 About the Guest:
Dr. Laura Vater is a gastrointestinal oncologist at the Indiana University Simon Comprehensive Cancer Center, where she leads the Young Onset Colorectal and GI Cancer Program. Beyond her clinical practice, Dr. Vater is a writer, TEDx and commencement speaker, and a passionate advocate for the well-being of patients and healthcare workers. She co-founded the Writing for Wellness Narrative Medicine Program at Indiana University School of Medicine and developed the SMILE Scale, a wellness behavior tool designed to support both patients and clinicians.

🔗 Connect with Dr. Vater:
📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doclauravater/
💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/laura-b-vater-md-mph-44380738/

🎙About the Host:
Dr. Amna Shabbir is a Dual Board-certified Physician, Master Certified Coach, Professional Speaker, Employee Wellness Strategist, Mental Health Advocate, and Super Mom. She empowers high achievers to redefine success and create sustainable well-being via coaching, speaking, and virtual programs. Dr.Shabbir is the Founder of Amna Shabbir Wellness Coaching and the Early Career Physicians Institute®, where she empowers high achievers to redefine success and create sustainable well-being.

This episode is part of her special book-writing project on unmasking perfectionism.

🔗Connect with Dr. Shabbir:
📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dr.amnashabbir/
💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amna-shabbir-md/
🌍 Book Her to Speak: https://www.dramnashabbir.com/Speaking

❌ Disclaimer: This podcast is for educational purposes only and does not constitute medical or therapeutic advice. The views expressed are personal and do not reflect those of any employer or institution.

❤️ Enjoyed This Episode?
Don’t forget to subscribe, rate, and review the podcast.
Share it with a colleague, peer, or friend who needs this message.

Have you been striving for apathy?

In this deeply moving and powerful conversation, Dr. Abby Spencer, Professor of Medicine, Vice Chair for Education, and Director of the Academy of Educators at Washington University, joins Dr. Amna Shabbir to unpack the high cost of perfectionism, the reality of burnout in medicine, and what it means to lead with heart.

Together, they explore:

✅Compassionate leadership in medicine
✅ The double standards women in leadership face
✅A special moment in Dr. Shabbir’s life when she was a medical trainee, and how Dr. Spencer helped avert her trauma.
✅Creating systems where vulnerability is safe
✅ Recognizing and recovering from burnout
✅The emotional toll of moral injury in healthcare

👤 About the Guest:
Abby Spencer, MD, MS, FACP, is a nationally recognized leader in internal medicine and medical education. She serves as Professor of Medicine, Vice Chair for Education in the Department of Medicine, and Director of the Academy of Educators at Washington University School of Medicine. Known for her fierce advocacy for trainees, women in medicine, and values-driven leadership, Dr. Spencer has mentored hundreds of physicians throughout her career, including Dr. Shabbir.

🔗Connect with Dr. Spencer:
X: https://x.com/abbyWUim

🎙About the Host:
Dr. Amna Shabbir is a Dual Board-certified Physician, Master Certified Coach, Professional Speaker, Corporate Wellness Strategist, Mental Health Advocate, and Super Mom. She empowers high achievers to redefine success and create sustainable well-being via coaching, speaking, and virtual programs. Dr. Shabbir is the Founder of Amna Shabbir Wellness Coaching and the Early Career Physicians Institute®, where she empowers high achievers to redefine success and create sustainable well-being.

This episode is part of her special book-writing project on unmasking perfectionism.

🔗Connect with Dr. Shabbir:
📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dr.amnashabbir/
💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amna-shabbir-md/
🌍 Book Her to Speak: https://www.dramnashabbir.com/Speaking

❌ Disclaimer: This podcast is for educational purposes only and does not constitute medical or therapeutic advice. The views expressed are personal and do not reflect those of any employer or institution.

❤️ Enjoyed This Episode?
Don’t forget to subscribe, rate, and review the podcast.
Share it with a colleague, peer, or friend who needs this message.