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Beyond Personality Types

Beyond Personality Types

By: Linda Berens and Olivier Caudron
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 Beyond Personality Types, The Official InterStrength Podcast Welcome to Beyond Personality Types, the podcast that dares to challenge the status quo in the world of personality typology and personal growth. I am your host, Olivier Caudron, a devoted self-discovery facilitator and confidence coach. I won't be the only one to guide you on this transformative journey. At the core of our show is the remarkable Dr. Linda Berens, a beacon of wisdom in the fields of psychology, authorship, and education. Her groundbreaking work in human and organizational development has paved the way for the InterStrength approach to self-discovery, a methodology that transcends mere assessment results. Our mission here at Beyond Personality Types is clear - we aim to shed light on the biases and limitations that often plague the world of personality typing. Through thought-provoking discussions, expert insights, and real-life anecdotes, we strive to push boundaries, broaden horizons, and ultimately propel this world out of its comfort zone. Join us as we delve deep into the intricacies of personality typology, offering you tools and a fresh perspective and mindset to navigate this complex landscape with grace and integrity. Whether you're a seasoned type practitioner or a curious enthusiast, our goal remains to empower you with the keys to understanding yourself and others on a profound level. So tune in, lean closer, and open your heart and mind to the transformative journey that awaits. Welcome to Beyond Personality Types, where we challenge assumptions, shatter limitations, and inspire growth. Thank you for listening.Linda V. Berens and Olivier C. Caudron Personal Success
Episodes
  • Revealing the Four Interaction Styles: Patterns, Behaviors, and Drives

    Revealing the Four Interaction Styles: Patterns, Behaviors, and Drives
    Jul 14 2025
    Transcript

    Here

    ℹ️ Introduction

    Welcome back to Beyond Personality Types, the podcast where we push past personality type labels and dive deep into practical frameworks for understanding human behavior. In this episode, hosts Linda Berens and Olivier Caudron continue their exploration of the Interaction Styles lens—a powerful approach for recognizing the subtle patterns that shape how we engage with the world and each other.

    Today, you'll discover four distinct patterns of interaction: In Charge, Get Things Going, Chart the Course, and Behind the Scenes. Linda and Olivier break down what drives each style, from the need to accomplish and move things forward, to a passion for involving others, an instinct to anticipate and prepare, and the desire to integrate perspectives for the best possible outcome. They share real-life examples and team dynamics, making it easy for you to spot these patterns at work, at home, or within yourself.

    Whether you’re a seasoned type practitioner or just starting your journey, this episode delivers practical wisdom and fresh insight to help you honor the diversity of interaction styles—so you can foster greater understanding, compassion, and effectiveness in any group. Let's go beyond type results and discover what truly shapes our behaviors and experiences.

    📚 Timestamped overview

    00:00 Drive and Motivation in Leadership

    03:45 Meeting Leadership and Team Dynamics

    08:27 "Structured Planning and Focused Action"

    10:22 Integrative Leadership Style Explained

    15:14 Optimizing Platform for Best Results

    19:06 Respecting Diverse Interaction Styles

    ❇️ Key topics and bullets

    1. Introduction to the Episode

    • Introduction of hosts (Linda Berens and Olivier Caudron).

    • Overview of the podcast’s purpose: moving beyond personality indicator results.

    • Framing of the episode: focusing on the Interaction Styles lens.

    • Promise of key takeaways: recognizing four patterns in interaction styles for increased self-awareness and understanding.

    2. The Four Interaction Styles Framework: Big Picture Overview

    • Explanation of the Interaction Styles as practical patterns in behavior.

    • The importance of identifying the core needs and drives behind each style.

    • How recognizing these patterns can help in team environments and personal growth.

    3. In-Depth Exploration of Each Interaction Style

    a. In Charge Pattern

    b. Get Things Going Pattern

    c. Chart the Course Pattern

    d. Behind the Scenes Pattern

    4. Practical Implications: Observing and Applying Interaction Styles

    • How these patterns appear in team settings and group dynamics.

    • Recognizing interaction styles in public figures or news events.

    • The importance of looking beyond surface behavior to underlying drives.

    • Strategies for practitioners: respecting differences, timing, energy, and creating inclusive environments.

    • Value of honoring and leveraging interaction styles for group effectiveness and harmony.

    5. Recap and Practical Wisdom for Practitioners

    • Summary of each pattern’s strengths and core needs:

      • In Charge: drive for results; not always about leading.

      • Get Things Going: thrives on involvement and collaboration.

      • Chart the Course: brings anticipation and preparation; values direction and clarity.

      • Behind the Scenes: consultative, integrating, seeks the best possible outcome.

    • Reminders to avoid assumptions and cultivate compassion and understanding.

    6. Resources and Closing

    • Reference to the resource booklet: “Understanding Yourself and Others: An Introduction to Interaction Styles.”

    • Teaser for the next episode: deeper exploration of each pattern.

    • Call to action: leave ratings, reviews, subscribe, and follow on social media.

    • Closing thoughts: a call to stay curious and committed to learning.
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    21 mins
  • Linda Berens on Creating and Validating the Interaction Styles Framework

    Linda Berens on Creating and Validating the Interaction Styles Framework
    Jul 2 2025
    Transcript Here ℹ️ Introduction Welcome to "Beyond Personality Types," where we invite you to step outside the confines of typical typology tools and explore the artistry behind personality theory. In this premiere episode of our special series on Interaction Styles, hosts Dr. Linda Berens—internationally recognized for her groundbreaking work in typology—and Olivier Caudron, self-discovery facilitator, take you on a journey into the origins and evolution of the Interaction Styles framework. Discover why some people naturally take charge while others shine from behind the scenes, and learn how focusing on holistic patterns—rather than isolated traits—can transform your understanding of personality. Linda takes us back to the foundational moments of Interaction Styles, revealing its connections with popular models like DISC and Social Styles, and unpacking the process of creating, validating, and continually refining this lens for real-world practice. Whether you’re a practitioner seeking fresh ways to support growth in clients and teams, or an enthusiast curious about the deeper layers of type, this series promises to open your mind to what personality theory can truly offer. Get ready to rethink, experiment, and bring a new level of nuance to your conversations about type. Let's go beyond personality types—together. 📚 Timestamped overview 00:00 Exploring Interaction Styles in Depth 05:25 Understanding Personality: Four Social Styles 06:26 Reimagining Myers-Briggs: New Type Names 10:47 Personality Type Stereotypes Analysis 15:39 Body Language Reveals Personality Traits 18:27 "Exploring Evolving Interaction Styles" 20:15 Exploring Interaction Styles Series ❇️ Key topics and bullets 1. Introduction to the Podcast and Series Overview of Beyond Personality Types and its purpose Introduction of hosts: Olivier Caudron and Dr. Linda Berens Clarification of podcast goals: going beyond MBTI and mainstream frameworks Explanation of the series focus on Interaction Styles 2. The Origins of Interaction Styles Early days of type exploration and involvement with personality models Initial experience with DISC and its perceived limitations Comparison of DISC, social styles, and Myers-Briggs type code Influence of Robert Bolton and Dorothy Grover Bolton's work (People Styles at Work) Experimentation with mapping MBTI types onto the four social and DISC styles 3. Clustering and Naming the Four Patterns Inspiration from Kersey’s approach to clustering MBTI types Identification of four patterns: Improviser, Stabilizer, Theorist, Catalyst Development of new names for interaction styles based on user-friendliness In Charge (correlating to Driver/High D in DISC) Chart the Course (correlating to Analytical/C in DISC) Behind the Scenes (correlating to Amiable/S in DISC) Get Things Going (correlating to Expressive/I in DISC) 4. Validating and Refining the Framework Writing and testing descriptions for each pattern Conducting field experiments at type conferences and workshops Gathering feedback and adjusting language in descriptions Discovering instances where MBTI preferences and interaction style didn’t always align Focus on keeping language neutral and descriptive for broader applicability 5. Application in Workshops and Professional Development Practical use of interaction styles in type workshops Early use and feedback on initial handouts with bullet point descriptions Continuous wordsmithing and improvement based on real-world responses Collection and analysis of workshop data (including group presentations and videos) 6. Research and Evidence for Interaction Styles Beyond Personality Theory Reference to Andy Cole’s 2016 master’s thesis on body language and Interaction Styles Experiment using actors to demonstrate styles Confirmation that body language communicates these patterns Development of training materials and videos to teach recognition of movement and energy patterns Availability of video training resources for practitioners 7. Importance of Holistic Pattern Recognition Emphasis on looking at patterns instead of isolated behavioral details Critique of instruments that break types into separated parts Anecdotal evidence from workshop experiences that people easily identify with the holistic style patterns 8. Broader Applications and Continuing Evolution Use of interaction styles in areas like team building and communication Ongoing refinement of the framework and descriptions (hinting at future updated editions) Responsibilities and opportunities for practitioners to keep evolving the typology 9. Conclusion and Next Steps Reflection on lessons learned from the episode Encouragement to cultivate curiosity and openness in type practice Teaser for future content: deeper dives into each interaction style, practical tools, and real-life stories Call to action: subscribe, rate/review, and follow on social media
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    22 mins
  • Introvert, Extravert, and the Danger of Simple Boxes

    Introvert, Extravert, and the Danger of Simple Boxes
    Jun 18 2025
    ℹ️ Introduction Welcome to Beyond Personality Types, the InterStrength podcast where we challenge what you think you know about personality. In today’s episode, host Olivier Caudron and expert Dr. Linda Berens go deeper than simple labels like “introvert” and “extrovert.” Instead of boxing people in, they explore the rich history and real meaning behind these terms—how they started as ways to describe where your mental energy is focused, not your whole identity. Whether you’re a type practitioner or just fascinated by personality, you’ll learn why seeing people through a holistic lens—beyond traits and stereotypes—matters more than ever. Join us as we uncover how understanding cognitive processes can free us from limiting assumptions, and support a more nuanced, empowering view of what makes each of us unique. Transcript: Here 📚 Timestamped overview 00:00 Exploring True Personality Insights 04:28 Understanding Myers' Dichotomy Creation 06:52 Understanding Personality Beyond Stereotypes 12:13 Exploring Introversion vs. Extroversion 14:21 Understanding Extroversion's Duality 17:27 Extraversion vs. Introversion Misconceptions 20:35 Debunking "Ambivert" Typology 25:30 "Embrace Unique Personalities" ❇️ Key topics and bullets 1. Introduction and Purpose of the Episode Overview of the podcast’s goal: going beyond personality type labels. Questioning if labeling someone as an introvert or extrovert truly captures personality depth. Intent to challenge stereotypes and oversimplifications in type theory. 2. Historical background of Introversion and Extraversion Jung’s early exploration of extroversion and introversion. Jung’s evolving model: from simple types to cognitive functions (perceiving and judging functions). The transformation of extraversion/introversion from nouns to adjectives in type theory. 3. Differentiating Jung’s Ideas from Modern Test-Based Approaches Myers’ adaptation for the MBTI (Myers-Briggs Type Indicator). Forced choice dichotomies in testing (e.g., party vs. theater preference). Shift toward seeing extroversion/introversion as stand-alone traits in popular usage. 4. The Holistic versus Trait-Based Perspective on Type Limitation of viewing extraversion/introversion as isolated, fixed labels. Introduction to holistic, systems-based thinking (pattern view). Contrasting traits model (e.g., the Big Five) with holistic type patterns. 5. Problems and Harm Caused by Stereotyping Negative effects of labeling (boxing people in, reinforcing stereotypes). Examples of how context and situation can make someone appear more or less extroverted. Importance of avoiding reductionist approaches in practice. 6. Precise Use of Type Language The value of using adjectives: “extraverted what?” or “introverted what?” Emphasis on the eight functions (e.g., extraverted intuiting, introverted sensing) instead of simple introvert/extrovert labels. Type as complex patterns rather than discrete, standalone traits. 7. Cultural and Systems Theory Influences Introduction to systems thinking through other disciplines (e.g., family therapy, architecture). Influence of Western versus Eastern perspectives on personality analysis. 8. Application in Coaching or Everyday Use The cautious use of “introvert” or “extrovert” in coaching. Helping clients see preferences as normal (e.g., reframing introversion as healthy in a society that values extroversion). 9. Cognitive Processes and Energy Focus Explaining extraversion and introversion as orientations of mental energy. Differences in behavior and cognition within the same perceptual or judging functions, depending on orientation. Real-life examples (e.g., differences between Linda Berens and her daughter in how they process intuition). 10. Complexity Within Types and Variation in Expression Differences in “energy” within introverted and extroverted preferences (laid-back vs. contained). Interaction styles and their relationship to type code (get-things-going, behind-the-scenes, etc.). Importance of considering context, not making assumptions based on surface behaviors. 11. The Ambivert Question Why ambivert is not needed if you understand the dynamic, adjective-based view. Critique of ambivert as a concept; it’s a sign of natural balance, not a separate type. 12. Age, Life Stage, and Flexibility in Type Expression Discussion on whether people become more introverted with age. Need for research and caution against drawing simple conclusions. Role of context (e.g., depression, life situation) in apparent expression of preferences. Potential for growth, development, and flexibility across the lifespan. 13. Final Takeaways and Practical Advice Go beyond labels: avoid boxing people in. Use precise, process-based language. Think holistically about personality patterns. Avoid harm: be mindful of stereotypes and their impact. Value context and the dynamic, flexible ...
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    27 mins
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