Learning Through Play: How Boddle Built Educational Games That Kids Actually Want

In this insightful conversation, Matt Watson talks with Clarence Tan, founder and CEO of Boddle Learning, about their journey building educational games that have reached over 10 million users. Clarence shares how they tackled the classic problem of educational games - how to make them as engaging as regular games while maintaining educational value. By creating fun games first and then "sneaking in" learning content, Boddle has found success in the competitive educational technology space.

The most valuable lesson? Get out of the office and actually watch users interact with your product. Rather than spending money on complex analytics, the Boddle team discovered their biggest product issues simply by visiting classrooms and observing how kids used their app. Clarence also shares how they eventually cracked the monetization code by understanding that parents were buying subscriptions not because they understood the educational benefits, but because their kids wanted the in-game items.

🔗 Essential Links (Start Here!):

Full Episodes: https://product-driven.captivate.fm/episodes

Connect with Matt Watson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattwatsonkc/

Subscribe to our Newsletter: https://newsletter.productdriven.com/

Powered by Full Scale: https://fullscale.io/

GET THE PRODUCT DRIVEN BOOK: https://productdriven.com/book

Check out Boddle here: https://www.boddlelearning.com/

Key Discussion Points:

🎮 Building educational games that are genuinely fun first

🧠 How Boddle "sneaks in" learning content after establishing engaging gameplay

💰 The journey from zero users to 10 million through COVID and beyond

📊 Why watching actual users beats fancy analytics tools

🔑 The monetization breakthrough: understanding kids are the real decision makers

🚀 Pivoting from building many games to focusing on the most successful one

📱 How Boddle connects with both teachers and parents

Chapters:

00:00 - Introduction and Welcome

00:46 - Origins of Boddle Learning

02:08 - Making Education Fun Through Games

04:17 - Early Funding and Productization

05:36 - Impact of COVID on Growth

07:42 - Getting on the White House Educational Resources List

08:19 - Server Challenges with Rapid Growth

09:04 - Moving to Tulsa for VC Funding

10:30 - The "Leaky Bucket" Discovery

11:21 - Monetization Challenges

13:57 - Finding the Most Popular Game Mode

14:51 - The Pet Battle Game Success

15:58 - NFT Experiment Mistakes

16:52 - Keeping Education in Fun Games

18:45 - The Power of Classroom Observation

20:47 - First-Time User Experience Issues

22:32 - Learning to Sell to Parents Through Kids

25:40 - Tapping Into the Entertainment Wallet

26:45 - Boddle Bucks and Future Growth

27:38 - Impact and Educational Value

Ready to transform your child's screen time into learning time? Visit https://www.boddlelearning.com/ to try their educational games that kids actually want to play!

In this enlightening conversation with author Ashley Davis, Matt Watson explores the concept of feedback-driven development and how it shapes effective software engineering practices. Ashley, author of "Bootstrapping Microservices" and the upcoming "The Feedback-Driven Developer," shares valuable insights on how developers can leverage feedback loops to enhance their productivity, make better decisions, and deliver more value to customers. They discuss the shifting landscape of software development in the age of AI, the importance of personal feedback systems, and why understanding product priorities is crucial for modern developers.

🔗 Essential Links:

🔗 Essential Links (Start Here!):

Full Episodes: https://product-driven.captivate.fm/episodes

Connect with Matt Watson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattwatsonkc/

Subscribe to our Newsletter: https://fullscaleteam.com/newsletter

Get our FREE Ebook: https://fullscaleteam.com/productfirstteams

Powered by Full Scale: https://fullscale.io/

GET THE PRODUCT DRIVEN BOOK: https://productdriven.com/book

Ashley Davis on Twitter: @ashleydavis75

"Bootstrapping Microservices" book: Manning.com/books/bootstrapping-microservices-with-docker-kubernetes-and-terraform

"The Feedback-Driven Developer" (Early Access): Manning.com

Key Discussion Points:

🔄 The concept of personal feedback loops in the development process

🎯 How prioritizing by "value over cost to deliver" leads to better decisions

🔍 The critical importance of getting clarity before diving into code

🚀 Why prototyping is one of the most effective feedback mechanisms

🤖 How AI is shifting the bottleneck from engineering to product decision-making

⚠️ The pitfall of "moving fast in the wrong direction" with AI assistance

🧩 Techniques for self-review and maintaining working code

🏗️ When microservices architecture makes sense (and when it doesn't)

Chapters

00:00 - Introduction and Welcome

00:25 - The Experience of Being a Tech Book Author

00:53 - Origins of "The Feedback-Driven Developer" Book

02:11 - Defining "Feedback" in Software Development

03:52 - The Importance of Understanding Trade-offs

05:35 - Ensuring You're Working on the Right Thing

07:34 - Getting Feedback on Implementation Approaches

09:06 - Clarity as the Fuel of Software Development

11:16 - AI's Impact on the Software Development Bottleneck

13:13 - Why the Best Developers Think Like Product Owners

14:54 - Process Theater vs. Value Delivery

16:19 - Building Feedback into Your Development Loop

17:23 - Production Monitoring and Performance Feedback

19:32 - Key Insights and Aha Moments from the Book

22:44 - Developers QA-ing Their Own Code

25:21 - When to Use Microservices Architecture

27:43 - Book Information and Closing Thoughts

Ready to transform your development process with effective feedback systems? Get early access to "The Feedback-Driven Developer" at

Bootstrapping vs VC: John Rush on Building 25 Successful Products 🚀

In this enlightening episode of Product Driven, host Matt Watson sits down with serial tech entrepreneur John Rush. Known for his prominent presence on social media platforms like Twitter (X) and LinkedIn, John shares his journey from VC-backed companies to successfully bootstrapping 25 different startups over the past 15 years. The conversation explores the stark differences between venture-backed and bootstrapped business models, the importance of UX in product development, and how focusing on solving specific problems has led to his remarkable success.

John provides valuable insights on identifying your strengths as a founder, why empathy for users matters more than code quality, and his unique approach to product development that allows him to launch multiple successful tools with minimal failure rapidly. His clear vision of building a lasting company that helps bootstrappers achieve a better work-life balance inspires developers considering the entrepreneurial path.

🔗 Essential Links (Start Here!):

Full Episodes: https://product-driven.captivate.fm/episodes

Connect with Matt Watson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattwatsonkc/

Subscribe to our Newsletter: https://newsletter.productdriven.com/

Powered by Full Scale: https://fullscale.io/

Chapters:

00:03 - Introduction to John Rush

00:31 - Thoughts on the "Indie Hacker" term

02:06 - VC-backed vs. Bootstrapped business models

04:30 - Creating and managing 25 different products

06:23 - Product success rate and failure assessment

08:32 - The seven tools driving 90% of revenue

11:22 - Competing in crowded markets

13:53 - Technology stack and code sharing across products

15:50 - The critical importance of UX in product design

23:19 - Approach to advertising and marketing

25:48 - Advice for software engineers considering entrepreneurship

30:57 - Long-term vision and goals

32:31 - Final words of wisdom

Transform your product development journey! Dive deeper into the entrepreneurial mindset that drives successful tech innovations. Whether you're a seasoned founder or just beginning your startup adventure, these resources will help you navigate the path with confidence and vision. 🚀

AI and Agency Evolution: Navigating the Future of Software Development 🚀

In this thought-provoking episode of Product Driven, Matt Watson welcomes Senad Santic, owner of Zendev software development agency and founder of LinkBound. They dive deep into how AI is reshaping software development agencies, training strategies for developers in this evolving landscape, and the challenges of diversifying from agencies into SaaS products. Both entrepreneurs share valuable insights on balancing innovation with realistic business concerns while navigating the rapidly changing technological environment.

🔗 Essential Links (Start Here!):

Full Episodes: https://product-driven.captivate.fm/episodes

Connect with Matt Watson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattwatsonkc/

Subscribe to our Newsletter: https://fullscaleteam.com/newsletter

Get our FREE Ebook: https://fullscaleteam.com/productfirstteams

Powered by Full Scale: https://fullscale.io/

Key Discussion Points:

The economic impact on dev agencies across different regions and markets

How AI tools like Lovable are changing the MVP development landscape

The increasing complexity of software development careers and adaptation challenges

Strategies for training developers to embrace AI while developing product thinking

The practical challenges of building SaaS products within an agency model

Chapters:

00:00 - Introduction and Background

03:08 - Economic Impact on Development Agencies

05:38 - AI's Impact on Development Businesses

07:16 - AI Tools for MVP Development

10:47 - The Reality of Using AI for Rapid Prototyping

15:28 - The Growing Complexity of Software Development

18:34 - Training Developers in Product Thinking and AI

24:24 - Why Business People Won't Replace Developers

28:27 - Building SaaS Products Within an Agency Model

33:23 - Structuring Teams for Product Development

35:06 - Conclusion and Parting Thoughts

Don't let your team fall behind in the AI revolution! The agencies that embrace these tools today will dominate the market tomorrow. Start your AI adoption journey now and transform how your developers work.

Building Human-Centric Engineering Teams: Culture, Motivation, & Purpose 🛠️

In this episode of Product Driven, Matt Watson talks with John Durant, founder of Human Centric Engineering, about the critical elements that create high-performing engineering cultures. John explains how mastery, autonomy, and purpose form the foundation of intrinsic motivation for engineers and how courage enables teams to overcome organizational fear.

They explore the challenges of Agile implementation, bureaucracy's impact on innovation, and practical approaches to measuring and improving engineering culture. This conversation reveals how small, intentional changes can transform team dynamics and why engineers have more power to shape their work environment than they realize.

🔗 Essential Links (Start Here!):

Full Episodes: https://product-driven.captivate.fm/episodes

Connect with Matt Watson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattwatsonkc/

Subscribe to our Newsletter: https://newsletter.productdriven.com/

Powered by Full Scale: https://fullscale.io/

Key Discussion Points:

The three pillars of intrinsic motivation are mastery, autonomy, and purpose

How Agile became "Frankenstein's monster" after starting with human-centered intentions

The importance of courage as the foundation for cultural transformation

Why fear is the operating system of many companies and how it limits potential

How small, bite-sized cultural changes create sustainable improvement

The power engineers have to shape their own work environment

Why company culture is essentially a collection of habits

Chapters:

00:00 - Introduction to John Durant and Human-Centric Engineering

02:08 - The Agile paradox: from human needs to bureaucracy

04:44 - How bureaucracy starts with good intentions but becomes restrictive

06:11 - Measuring engineering culture through team experience

09:49 - Self-determination theory: mastery, autonomy, and purpose

14:38 - Courage as the foundation for cultural improvement

19:08 - Creating cultural change through bite-sized initiatives

23:10 - Engineers feeling misunderstood and apathetic about change

25:39 - The power of hope and finding meaning in engineering work

26:46 - Resources for improving engineering culture

👉 Ready to transform your engineering culture? Like, subscribe, and share this episode with your team. Visit Human Centric Engineering to access their free culture survey tools and join the conversation about building better engineering environments!

🧪 The AI Testing Revolution: Reimagining QA in the Era of Generative Intelligence

In this intellectually stimulating conversation, Matt Watson and Nuwan Samarasekera (Founder & CEO of TestChimp) explore the transformative impact of generative AI on software testing methodologies. As AI accelerates development cycles, discover why testing has emerged as the new bottleneck and how innovative approaches are creating the perfect balance between deterministic reliability and adaptive intelligence.

This forward-looking discussion examines the shifting landscape of software quality assurance as AI-accelerated development creates new challenges and opportunities. Through exploration of TestChimp's innovative approach, discover how AI can transform testing through script generation, self-healing capabilities, and exploratory testing—while maintaining the critical balance between autonomous capabilities and human oversight that ensures reliable software delivery.

🔗 Essential Links (Start Here!):

Full Episodes: https://product-driven.captivate.fm/episodes

Connect with Matt Watson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattwatsonkc/

Subscribe to our Newsletter: https://fullscaleteam.com/newsletter

Get our FREE Ebook: https://fullscaleteam.com/productfirstteams

Powered by Full Scale: https://fullscale.io/

Connect with Nuwan Samarasekera: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nuwansam/

Check out TestChimp: https://testchimp.i

Key Discussion Points:

🧠 The paradigm shift as AI transforms development bottlenecks into testing challenges

💡 Balancing deterministic reliability with adaptive intelligence in testing

🔄 The critical difference between AI at authoring time versus runtime execution

⚡ How AI observes manual testing to generate maintainable test scripts

📊 The role of exploratory testing and "monkey testing" in comprehensive QA

🌱 Self-healing test scripts that maintain integrity through UI changes

🚀 Using browser-based AI agents to evaluate intuitive user experience

Chapters:

0:00 - Introduction and AI testing landscape

0:59 - GenAI's impact on development cycles

2:51 - The new bottleneck in software delivery

4:40 - Comparing development to testing complexity

6:42 - Balancing predictability with adaptation

8:01 - The pessimistic mindset needed for testing

10:41 - The challenge of deterministic AI testing

12:48 - The danger of AI adapting to bugs

14:28 - TestChimp's approach to AI-assisted testing

16:54 - Using AI to determine what to test

19:27 - Exploratory testing and its conversion to scripts

22:58 - Browser-based AI as UX testing methodology

25:14 - TestChimp's unique approach and capabilities

Transform your understanding of software quality assurance in the AI era through this intellectual exploration of where deterministic reliability meets adaptive intelligence. Join our journey into the future of testing, where AI becomes not just a tool for development but a catalyst for comprehensive quality control that keeps pace with accelerated innovation.

🔍 Engineering Visibility: Unlocking Team Performance at Scale with Hacker Pulse

In this intellectually stimulating exploration, Matt Watson and Gleb Braverman (Founder & CEO of Hacker Pulse) delve into the universal challenges that emerge when engineering organizations reach critical mass. From identifying "ghost engineers" to optimizing team composition across time zones, discover why seemingly unique organizational challenges are actually common patterns that can be systematically addressed through data-driven insights.

This thought-provoking discussion examines the evolutionary challenges engineering organizations face as they scale beyond the natural limits of human supervision. Through Hacker Pulse's research with hundreds of engineering leaders, Gleb reveals that despite each organization believing their challenges are unique, most face identical visibility and optimization problems once team sizes cross critical thresholds. The conversation explores how algorithmic team assembly, natural language analytics, and integrated performance metrics can transform engineering leadership from gut feelings to data-driven decisions.

🔗 Essential Links (Start Here!):

Full Episodes: https://product-driven.captivate.fm/episodes

Connect with Matt Watson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattwatsonkc/

Subscribe to our Newsletter: https://fullscaleteam.com/newsletter

Get our FREE Ebook: https://fullscaleteam.com/productfirstteams

Powered by Full Scale: https://fullscale.io/

Connect with Gleb Braverman: https://www.linkedin.com/in/glebbraverman/

Check out HackerPulse here: https://hackerpulse.io

Key Discussion Points:

🧠 The critical 70-75 person threshold where visibility problems emerge

💡 Transitioning from technical metrics to people-oriented optimization

🔄 Using AI-powered team assembly to reduce team formation from weeks to minutes

⚡ Detecting workload imbalances and meeting inefficiencies across distributed teams

📊 The "ghost engineer" phenomenon and its impact on high-performing teammates

🌱 Building a culture of customer centricity through strategic hiring practices

🚀 Leveraging natural language queries to transcend static dashboards

Chapters:

0:00 - Introduction to engineering visibility challenges

0:54 - Critical team size thresholds

2:11 - Common engineering leadership pain points

3:49 - Tools limitations in scaling organizations

4:22 - AI-powered team assembly approaches

5:22 - Evaluating engineering metrics frameworks

8:12 - Identifying and addressing people problems

10:20 - Universal engineering management challenges

12:33 - The future of engineering analytics

15:29 - The "ghost engineer" phenomenon

18:05 - Maintaining customer focus at scale

20:10 - Upcoming trends in engineering productivity

Transform your understanding of engineering productivity beyond individual performance metrics to organizational optimization through this intellectual exploration of how data can illuminate the human dynamics of technical teams. Join our journey into the future of engineering leadership, where visibility at scale becomes the foundation for...

Full Scale Ventures Launches & The Power of Venture Studios 🚀

In this transformative episode of Product Driven, host Matt Watson introduces his exciting new venture with Craig Ferril—Full Scale Ventures. They dive deep into the concept of venture studios, exploring various models and explaining why they've launched their own. The conversation reveals how their combined expertise in technology, strategy, and operations positions them to create successful startups with significantly lower risk by leveraging global talent and shared resources.

Craig Ferril joins Matt Watson as Chief Strategy Officer for Full Scale Ventures, bringing operational excellence and people-focused leadership to complement Matt's product expertise.

🔗 Essential Links (Start Here!):

Full Episodes: https://product-driven.captivate.fm/episodes

Connect with Matt Watson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattwatsonkc/

Subscribe to our Newsletter: https://fullscaleteam.com/newsletter

Get our FREE Ebook: https://fullscaleteam.com/productfirstteams

Powered by Full Scale: https://fullscale.io/

GET THE PRODUCT DRIVEN BOOK: https://productdriven.com/book

EngagePath: https://engagepath.com (Sign up for beta or waitlist)

Key Discussion Points:

What is a venture studio, and how does it differ from VCs, accelerators, and incubators

The advantages of building products with offshore talent at a fraction of US costs

Why traditional VC models often fail founders despite successful exits

Introduction of their first product: EngagePath—a tool for social selling

How Full Scale's existing resources provide an "unfair advantage" in startup creation

Episode Chapters:

00:07 - Introduction to Full Scale Ventures

01:39 - Defining the venture studio model

03:31 - Their specific approach to venture building

07:55 - Leveraging Full Scale's existing resources

10:03 - The talent advantage in global teams

13:49 - Problems with traditional VC and PE models

17:23 - The rise of "seed strapping" as an alternative

22:42 - The perfect partnership chemistry

24:19 - Introducing EngagePath, their first product

28:49 - Closing thoughts on their exciting journey

Are you intrigued by the venture studio model? Take the next step in your entrepreneurial journey! Visit EngagePath.com to join the waitlist for their first product, or connect with Matt Watson on LinkedIn to explore potential collaboration opportunities.

If you're looking to build your software product with experienced teams at affordable rates, check out FullScale.io to see how their global talent model can accelerate your vision into reality. Subscribe to the podcast for upcoming episodes featuring more insights from the venture studio's journey!