Is the small church model dead? In this explosive episode of Lead Time, Tim Ahlman and Jack Kalleberg sit down with Pastor Rob Myallis (ELCA) for a brutally honest conversation about the economic realities choking the life out of mid-sized churches. With rising costs, unsustainable pastoral expectations, and shifting cultural engagement, Rob unpacks why churches averaging 80–120 in attendance may not survive without radical change.

We tackle everything:

• $30,000 health insurance costs
• Why 150 people is the relational ceiling
• The burnout crisis among solo pastors
• Why people treat church like a rec center, not a sanctuary
• And the hard truth: your old church model probably isn’t working

If you’ve ever asked, “Why are so many churches declining?” or “What future does my congregation really have?”—this one’s for you.

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Bob Sundquist takes us on a captivating journey through the turbulent founding story of the Lutheran Church Missouri Synod—a tale far more complex and human than most church histories acknowledge. Moving beyond simplified narratives of heroes and villains, Sundquist reveals how the first "celebrity pastor" of the LCMS, Martin Stephan, led 700 Saxon immigrants to America in 1838 only to face accusations and eventual exile across the Mississippi River.

This conversation reveals how historical understanding helps us navigate present church tensions between pastoral and congregational authority.

• History is fundamentally about storytelling and understanding people, not just memorizing dates
• Martin Stephan was the first "celebrity pastor" of the LCMS whose leadership eventually created a crisis
• The accusations against Stephan of sexual impropriety likely had no concrete evidence but were used to remove him
• C.F.W. Walther developed Lutheran understanding of church authority through the trauma of Stephan's removal
• Pastors should focus primarily on Word and Sacrament ministry rather than business management
• The LCMS has historically had a hyper-fixation on the Office of Ministry as a result of early traumas
• Walther's "Duties of an Evangelical Lutheran Synod" (1879) offers wisdom for contemporary church conflicts
• The Missouri Synod repeats the same resolutions without taking action, indicating unresolved tensions

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What happens when the traditional path to ministry isn't an option? For Pastor Eli Thomas, the journey to becoming an LCMS pastor meant navigating uncharted waters through the colloquy process while balancing family responsibilities, work, and education over eleven challenging years.

What began as a winding path through different denominations ultimately led him back to Lutheran theology through his rediscovery of the real presence of Christ in the sacraments.

• Taking 11 years to complete undergraduate and seminary education while working and raising a family
• Navigating the challenging colloquy process to become an LCMS pastor
• Finding joy in interactive Bible study that transforms both teacher and students
• Serving two congregations simultaneously, including one with an average age of 80
• Moving from lecture-style teaching to dialogue that helps people experience Scripture
• Reflecting on convention experiences and hopes for the future of pastoral formation
• Discovering God's faithfulness when facing unexpected challenges

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Join the Lead Time Newsletter! (Weekly Updates and Upcoming Episodes)
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