In this episode of The Ministry Mix Podcast, Phil and Richard sit down with their friend Josh, pastor of Cross & Anchor Church in Detroit, to explore a story filled with calling, closed doors, disappointment, grit, and God’s surprising redirection.
Josh shares the compelling journey he and his wife walked—from serving in Montana, to believing God was calling them to plant a church in London, to being unexpectedly detained at Heathrow Airport, sent back to the U.S., and forced into a two-year season they never anticipated.

Through moments of shock, grief, confusion, and wrestling, Josh describes how God reshaped their hearts, refined their calling, and ultimately led them to Detroit. His story offers deep encouragement for pastors and ministry leaders who feel stuck, discouraged, or tempted to quit.

This is a raw, honest, hope-filled look at what it means to discern God’s will in uncertainty, endure the dark-room seasons of development, and keep moving forward when quitting feels easier.

Key Themes:

1. When Calling Collides with Reality
2. The “Dark Room” Season of Development
3. How Do You Know When to Push Through or Pivot?
4. Why You Shouldn’t Quit on Your Worst Day
5. God’s Provision on the Other Side of Obedience


Key Quotes:

“What you sow doesn’t come to life unless it dies.”
“Don’t quit. You can’t see the fulfillment of the dream if you quit.”
“God develops us in the dark room so we can carry what He gives us later.”
“Quit on Monday if you need to, but show back up on Tuesday.”

Who This Episode Is For:

Church planters navigating uncertainty
Pastors wrestling with discouragement
Leaders dealing with roadblocks or doubt
Anyone trying to discern the difference between perseverance and redirection
Ministry teams needing a reminder that God is faithful through “the in-between”