“She was a beautiful person, loving and warm...She was down-to-earth, she loved to laugh, and everyone loved her.” - Marvin Gaye, on fellow Motown star and original Supreme Florence Ballard

This week, the Dolls Pod presents the true story behind the Tony-winning musical “Dreamgirls,” and the very real woman that was its muse. Both Jennifer Holliday and Jennifer Hudson won Academy awards for their portrayals of Effie White, based on the fiery founder of the Supremes. Florence Ballard sang on 16 of their top 40 hits, and 9 of their number ones. But she did not have the happy ending Effie gets in “Dreamgirls.” She’s often called “the Lost Supreme,” as she was virtually erased from the group’s history. But as this episode will show you, Flo Ballard was anything but “just a backup singer.” She was brave in the face of hardship and a true trailblazer; the soul of Motown’s first girl group. “Florence Ballard: The Real Effie White” is available wherever you stream your podcasts 🎤

(Episode starts at 4:50)

Sources used for this episode:

Peter Benjaminson, “The Lost Supreme: The Life of Dreamgirl Florence Ballard” (2009)

Nelson George, “Where Did Our Love Go? The Rise and Fall of the Motown Sound” (2007 ed.)

Randall Wilson, “Forever Faithful: A Study of Florence Ballard and the Supremes” (1987)

Mary Wilson, “Dreamgirl: My Life as a Supreme” (1986)

Maxine Ballard Jenkins, “The True Story of Florence Ballard” (2007)

“Unsung” season 2 episode 4, “Florence Ballard” (6/28/2009)

“Mary Wilson Gets Emotional Remembering Florence Ballard” via SiriusXM on YouTube, 9/24/2019

Songs used in this episode:

Jennifer Hudson - “And I Am Telling You I’m Not Going” (From the soundtrack of “Dreamgirls”) [2006]

Frankie Lymon and the Teenagers - “Why Do Fools Fall In Love” (1956)

Ray Charles - “The Right Time” (1958)

Smokey Robinson and the Miracles - “Shop Around” (1960)

The Primettes - “Tears of Sorrow” (1961)

The Supremes - “Buttered Popcorn” (1962)

The Marvelettes - “Please Mr. Postman” (1961)

The Contours - “Do You Love Me” (1962)

Mary Wells - “You Beat Me To The Punch” (1962)

The Supremes - “When The Lovelight Starts Shining Through His Eyes” (1963)

The Supremes - “Where Did Our Love Go?” (1964)

The Supremes - “Baby Love” (1964)

The Beatles - “Money (That’s What I Want)” (1964)

The Supremes - “Stop! In The Name of Love” (1965)

The Supremes - “You Keep Me Hangin’ On” (1966)

Vanilla Fudge - “You Keep Me Hangin’ On” (1967)

The Supremes - “Ain’t That Good News” (1965)

The Supremes - “People” (1967)

Scott McKenzie - “San Fransisco” (1967)

Florence Ballard - “It Doesn’t Matter How I Say It” (1968)

Sheryl Lee Ralph, Loretta Devine, and Jennifer Holliday - “Dreamgirls” (From the original Broadway cast recording of “Dreamgirls”) (1982)

Follow @thedollspod on Instagram to see clips and photos from this episode!

We have a very special guest for our season 3 premiere! Thanks to Emma, we got to chat with “Jennifer Juniper: A Journey Beyond The Muse” author Jenny Boyd about her time as a model in swinging London, San Fransisco during the Summer of Love, with the Beatles in India, and on the road with Fleetwood Mac at the height of their fame. We also got to talk about her earning her doctorate, exploring the creative process in her thesis “Musicians in Tune”/“Icons of Rock,” her work in the addiction recovery field, and an exciting new project. It’s well and truly a journey beyond being a muse. Thank you Jenny for joining us this week!

Plus, Emma gives a life update on her growing family and how she found her midcentury dream home! “Jennifer Juniper: An Interview with Jenny Boyd” is available now wherever you stream your podcasts 💐

Jenny’s website: www.thejennyboyd.com

Sources used for this episode:

Jenny Boyd, “Jennifer Juniper: A Journey Beyond The Muse” (2020)

Jim Farber, “‘It’s not what you think’: Behind the star-studded life of a rock star’s wife” The Guardian, 3/30/2020

Songs used in this episode:

Donovan - “Jennifer Juniper” (1968)

Fleetwood Mac - “Purple Dancer” (1971)

Follow @thedollspod on Instagram for clips and photos from this episode!

“I think that love will never die. Once you know somebody, you can never unknow that person. And knowing is loving. So you never can get out of love.”

The Dolls Pod Beatle Girl miniseries concludes! Part two of our “Oh Yoko!” episode focuses on her music, activism, and of course, we tell the ballad of Yoko and John.

Also: car seats and nurseries and baby names, oh my! Emma is settling into her last few weeks before baby arrives. Join us for the emotional season two finale of the Dolls Podcast, available wherever you stream your podcasts ☁️

Sources used for this episode:

David Sheff, “Yoko” (2025)

Jann Wenner, “Lennon Remembers” (2000)

David Sheff, “The Playboy Interviews with John Lennon & Yoko Ono” (edited by G. Barry Golson, 1981)

Cynthia Lennon, “John” (2005)

May Pang with Henry Edwards, “Loving John” (1983)

The Beatles, “Anthology” (2000)

Alan Clayson, Barb Jungr, and Robb Johnson, “Woman: The Incredible Life of Yoko Ono” (2004)

J. Hoberman, “Everything Is Now: The 1960s New York Avant-Garde - Primal Happenings, Underground Moves, Radical Pop” (2025)

Elvis Mitchell, “Yoko Ono” Interview Magazine, 11/26/2013

Lisa Carver, “Yoko Ono: A Reconsideration” The New York Times, 10/19/2012

“One To One: John & Yoko” (dir. Kevin MacDonald and Sam Rice-Edwards, 2025)

“Classic Albums: John Lennon - Plastic Ono Band” (dir. Matthew Longfellow, 2008)

(Episode starts at 7:08)

Songs used in this episode:

Yoko Ono - “Yes, I’m A Witch” (2007)

Plastic Ono Band - “Give Peace A Chance” (1969)

Yoko Ono - “Don’t Worry Kyoko” (1969)

John Lennon - “Mother” (1970)

John Lennon - “Imagine” (1971)

“Glee End Credits Theme” (2009)
Yoko Ono - “Approximately Infinite Universe” (1973)

John Lennon - “Beautiful Boy” (1980)

John Lennon - “Just Like Starting Over” (1980)

Yoko Ono - “Talking To The Universe” (1995)

Fiona Apple - “I Want You To Love Me” (2020)

Yoko Ono, Kim Gordon & Thurston Moore - “Mirror Mirror” (2012)

Death Cab For Cutie - “Waiting For The Sunrise” (Yoko Ono Cover) [2022]

John Lennon - “Oh Yoko!” (1971)

With samples from Monday Night Football, 12/8/1980, and Yoko’s Grammys acceptance speech, 2/24/1982

Follow @thedollspod on Instagram for clips and photos from this episode!