In this episode Mark opens with a tribute to one of his earliest camp mentors, Neil Fichthorn, the longtime executive director at Sandy Cove. Mark shares the leadership lessons Neil taught him — including the phrase that became foundational to this podcast: “You can’t minister to empty beds.”

Carl’s quick camp marketing tip focuses on why your Google Business Profile may be quietly costing you bookings. He explains how local search results work, why reviews and categories matter, and how small profile updates can improve visibility for camps and retreat centers.

The featured conversation is with Casey Fuerst, owner of Tic Tac Toe Marketing, who spent 18 years serving at a Lutheran camp in Nebraska before launching an agency focused on camps and nonprofits. Casey shares how camp shaped her personally and why she now helps camps communicate more clearly.

The conversation explores one of the biggest problems Casey sees on camp websites: cluttered messaging. Using her “hall closet” analogy, she explains why trying to communicate everything at once confuses parents and retreat guests instead of helping them take action. The episode also covers Donald Miller’s StoryBrand framework and practical ways camps can simplify messaging, strengthen positioning, and improve marketing clarity.

Keywords

camp marketing, camp website design, StoryBrand for camps, camp messaging, Christian camp marketing

Sound Bites

• “If everybody thinks their stuff belongs on the front page of the website, it becomes the junk drawer.”
• “Clear is kind. Clever is not.”
• “Most organizations are communicating at an eight when customers only need a two.”

Hosts

Mark P. Fisher, Inspiring Growth
Carl Lefever, Improve & Grow

Guest

Casey Fuerst, Tic Tac Toe Marketing

Chapters

00:05 Introduction
02:11 Today's Topic: Messaging & Clarity
02:45 Quick Tip: Your Google Business Profile
10:19 Messaging and Brand Positioning
10:51 Meet Casey Fuerst
12:31 Casey's Camp Story
12:34 Personal Camp Stories and Experiences
13:37 The Impact of Camp Experiences on Young Adults
16:11 Marketing Insights for Camps
16:20 The Hall Closet Problem
19:28 The Importance of Clear Messaging
22:01 The StoryBrand Framework
22:11 The StoryBrand Framework in Action
25:14 Real-World Examples of Messaging Success
25:43 Finding Your One Message
28:14 Navigating New Audiences and Digital Marketing
28:56 Messaging Wins: Real Stories
31:14 Celebrating Podcast Milestones and Future Directions
38:56 Where Messaging Works Best
42:45 Reaching New Audiences
46:14 Wrap-Up & Celebrating Episode 10

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In this episode Mark shares a quick tip about rebooking—the most affordable and often overlooked path to growth. He explains why camps should aim for 60–80% rebooking, how it reflects guest experience, and why low rebooking points to a systems problem, not demand. He also outlines practical steps: know your numbers, pursue rebookings immediately, and protect dates.

Carl then interviews Kathi and Bob Terrell, who share how Emanuel Pines Camp grew from roughly $900,000 to over $2 million in a few years. Their story begins with a plateau—limited growth, aging facilities, and reactive leadership—until they chose to pursue growth intentionally and bring in outside perspective.

The biggest changes weren’t just marketing. They clarified positioning, improved first impressions, and focused on attracting the right audience. At the same time, they invested in their team with systems like the “I See You” recognition program and mission-driven onboarding to reinforce culture daily.

They also introduced tools like the “Peace Card” to train staff in customer service and ensure every guest interaction reflects their mission. Along with ongoing facility improvements and a focus on removing distractions, these changes strengthened experience and loyalty.

As demand increased, they adapted by adding staff, clarifying roles, and implementing virtual sales to improve responsiveness and conversion. The result was not just revenue growth, but stronger rebooking, healthier culture, and a more sustainable operation.

Keywords
camp marketing strategy, rebooking systems, guest experience, team culture, retreat center growth, virtual sales, camp leadership, first impressions, staff development

Sound Bites

• “If you’re below 50% rebooking, something is broken.”
• “We started looking at camp through someone else’s eyes.”
• “We just became more intentional about everything.”
• “Nothing is more important than attending to guest needs.”

Hosts

Mark P. Fisher, Inspiring Growth
Carl Lefever, Improve & Grow

Guests

Kathi Terrell & Bob Terrell, Emmanuel Pines Camp

Chapters
00:00 Episode Welcome
00:45 Quick Camp Marketing Tip: Rebooking
07:36 Bob and Kathy's Camp Journey
13:15 Understanding Emanuel Pines Camp
15:42 Challenges and Growth at Emanuel Pines
23:26 Key Changes Leading to Growth
23:56 Understanding Purposeful Growth Strategies
25:45 Cultivating Team Relationships and Culture
28:00 Mission-Driven Orientation and Guest Experience
30:20 The Peace Card: Enhancing Customer Service
35:24 Navigating Marriage and Leadership
40:20 Virtual Sales: A New Approach to Growth
46:30 Sustaining Marriage and Leadership in Camp Management
51:41 Podcast Intro Animation 16x9.mp4

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• Schedule a Chat with Carl >

In this episode, Carl shares a practical marketing tip on turning past guests into your next booking engine—one of the fastest, most cost-effective ways to increase occupancy without chasing entirely new leads. By segmenting your audience and sending timely, relevant follow-up emails, camps can unlock a major source of repeat business that often goes underused.

Then Mark interviews Bob Briscoe, Executive Director of Williamsburg Christian Retreat Center, brings a long-term perspective shaped by decades in camping—from his early experiences as a camper and trail guide to leading the organization through seasons of change. That background informs how he approaches leadership, balancing mission, relationships, and financial sustainability.

The conversation walks through how the camp moved from inconsistent, “spiky” bookings to steady growth. Faced with unpredictable revenue and underperforming programs, Bob and his team made key decisions to simplify their offerings, focus on profitable guest groups, and invest in improving their marketing visibility. The result was fewer gaps, stronger midweek bookings, and significant growth in room nights—including doubling occupancy in one of their primary lodging facilities.

This episode highlights what actually drives sustainable growth: clear decisions about what to stop doing, systems that support consistent marketing, and the willingness to seek outside help when internal capacity runs thin.

Keywords
camp growth, retreat center marketing, camp occupancy, guest group strategy, camp revenue growth, digital marketing for camps, camp leadership, camp operations, retreat booking consistency

Sound Bites

• “Our bookings were spiky… full weekends and then crickets.”
• “The big change was answering the phone because it was ringing.”
• “You can’t afford the person you need—so get the right help another way.”
• “Be open to asking for help and being teachable.”

Hosts

Mark P. Fisher, Inspiring Growth
Carl Lefever, Improve & Grow

Guest

Bob Briscoe, Williamsburg Christian Retreat Center

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Podcast Format
00:05 Marketing Strategies for Camps
03:00 Bob Briscoe's Journey in Camp Leadership
06:05 Understanding Williamsburg Christian Retreat Center
09:12 Challenges and Changes in Camp Operations
12:14 Navigating Program Adjustments and Guest Groups
16:51 Innovative Retreat Solutions
17:58 Recognizing the Need for External Help
19:23 Evaluating Marketing Partnerships
22:15 Navigating Budget Approvals
24:20 Implementing Changes Post-COVID
26:37 Tracking Revenue Growth
28:24 Creative Strategies During Challenges
29:24 Future Growth Focus
31:07 Encouragement for Stuck Camp Directors
35:33 Personal Insights on Marriage Growth

Have a question you'd like us to cover?

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If this episode was helpful:

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• Share it with another camp leader who could benefit

Want Help Growing Your Camp?

• Schedule a Chat with Mark >
• Schedule a Chat with Carl >